 Creating History |
KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,831
Location: USA / Taiwan
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thank you, (I assume you talking to me)
Dwemer were great metallurgists and geologists... and I guess in a sense that is good alchemy... inorganic-wise?
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2006.10.31 03:56 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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Seems alchemy would be a weaker poitn of the Dwemer, given their specialty in all-things-unnatural.
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Your monkeys dance on the Tower and the stars change and you do not remember.
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2006.10.31 04:25 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,831
Location: USA / Taiwan
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Hrafnkel
Seems alchemy would be a weaker poitn of the Dwemer, given their specialty in all-things-unnatural. |
I dunno... I always thought Alchemy was also unnaturl and inanimate in TES since plenty of metals and stuff being mixed in 
and that Kemel-Ze book mentioned that ther guy wanted an alchemist to see what the metal were... 
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2006.10.31 06:46 |
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Joe Venice
Warder
Registration Date: 2006.01.24
Posts: 40
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He was a powerful wizard. That is all anyone knew or cared to know of
the old dunmer who wandered the wastes north of Silgrad. We did not
mind though, we worked for our coin and to us it spoke plenty. It told
us sweet stories about food and warmth for ourselves and families, it
spun us ripe lies about the riches we would receive when we had reached
the end, and it gave us dark nightmares about what awaited us when we
failed.
We had reached the door. The lot of us could see the inscriptions about
its face, the etchings of those hands, long since stripped of their
flesh, had gone unworn in these dank, airless caverns. We could not
understand the warning, but we knew it. None of us doubted that it was
there to keep us out just as much as it was meant to keep something in.
The wizard took no heed. He did not fear the warning and held no fear
for threats that were no longer held by withered lips. But perhaps he
was wrong, for the thing that filled the void between us ripped flesh,
smashed bone, and strewn the waste upon the molten floor. Perhaps he
was wrong, for he retreated into his books and lies to seek the key to
shut tight the door beyond this threshold. Perhaps he was wrong, for
the ruins and stonework build high above us, burying us deeper into the
world, but never out of arms reach. Perhaps he was wrong, because he
has bound us to this place, never again to see the stars or the sky, to
keep this way and hold back the abomination he let slip the binds.
"We of Kedal keep our lonely vigil, outlander. But we are far from alone. Pray you last the night. "
Random Notes:
Apprentice of Shalidor.
The force to break Rourken.
The aegis to defeat a necromancer.
The buried city of Kedal.
An outlander lost underground.
"My skin...my beautiful skin. It shone like gold leaf in the dawn. But
in the dusk, the sun burnt, and the leaves turned to ash. . So long
ago...and yet so soon."
"We were here before they raised him up. We were here when they tore
him down and took his honor for themselves. We remained here when he
returned and cast them down in turn. But we stay, unchanged and
unfaltering, no matter how the storm rages beyond these halls of stone.
That is why we need no gods, outlander, we have outlasted them."
(Note: I'll clean up this mess as soon as I can.)
__________________
"Show me a hero and I will write you a tragedy."
F. Scott Fitzgerald
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2006.11.01 05:17 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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Alchemy is the art of the transmutation of metals among other things.
Consider the philosopher's stone and the common transmutation of lead
to gold if you will.
The Cerro are concentrating on certain 'medicinal, illusory and
metaphysical aspects, but there is obviously more to it than that.
However, although this is an apparently powerful theme, I am not sure
how you go from describing the people of Kedal as the greatest
magicians ever - to hand-me-down dwemer... metallurgists?
And then they become masters of concealment... umm, like the Cerro?
Plus, what you are now describing is a Dwemer Fortress ... well it has
to be if the Dwemmer were set up there, and I seem to remember that was
declared off limits for the mainland by Razorwing ... all dwemer
remains to be on Vvardenfell... though that may have changed?
But the dwemer relationship is wonderfully done - esp re the
language... and I would want to keep that, if in a different form...
The spirit is a very nice touch ...
So...
? Hows about turning it around?
I have posted a story in Lit Dev - it will be the first full raggidman
story, currently called the Chimer and the Spirit. Adapted from the
lore that I have been building for the background of the Cerro, it may
provide a sound basis for your history without Lore conflicts...
including when finished bringing ST policy and Lore generally and ESF
Lore into closer harmony, I hope - I look forward to people discovering
and correcting me on any bits I have missed or plain got wrong.
Natch if you do not want to use this book I might well adjust it and transfer it to another mod.
Further, there is still the possibility of some link up with the Cerro.
Much of this is remarkably similar to the Cerro Lore that has been
building up over the past couple of years, and that could be turned to
very positive advantage...
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Editor and Core Valenwood
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by raggidman: 2006.11.01 20:24.
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2006.11.01 11:30 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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2006.11.01 20:23 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,831
Location: USA / Taiwan
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wait I don't get it... what happened?
so Joe Venice has a proposal or is building off of one? off of mine?
raggidman, you trying to relate my proposal with Cerro Clan or a new proposal/story?
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2006.11.01 21:57 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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read the story in Lit Dev KKA - you are my co-moderator there are you not?
I am saying that there are great ideas in there but they need to turn
around a bit as they are startin to parallel other stuff that is
already building up?
So I wrote a story based partly on some ideas that I developed for the
Cerro and the Uni and offer it as a readjustment of perspective to
avoid too much duplication. The stuff that I offer will not harm
further Cerro developement.
They clarify the positions you and others put KKA, which I am worried
about, as if those positions stood entirely unchanged they might be
interpreted as being something a tiny bit too similar to the Cerro...
and I don't want either project treading on the other's toes...
The story also adds new options and ensures that both communities hold
their own unique qualities, and could make Kedal and th eCerro
suficiently different that they could interact without 'samey
criticism.'
And it tries to add something from far earlier times = pre-Nirn -
something that has the correct feel. And I feel we need some truly
pre-ancient Lore in ST, however vague.
Lastly, if Steinaech is happy to work this my way I will add a tit-bit
that mayl have you all rather eager to model... - htat's bribery by the
way... 
Again KKA, please read the Cerro and University Threads. The synopsis I sent you was just a taster.
Steinaech - best of luck with the sorting out thing 
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Editor and Core The Elsweyr Confederacy
Editor and Core Valenwood
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2006.11.02 00:10 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,831
Location: USA / Taiwan
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alright...
the cerro stuff, I been reading bit by bit, a few posts at a time...
as for samenessness yeah a little, I see what you mean 
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2006.11.02 02:42 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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Provided the Alchemy side of Kedal clearly focusses on Metallurgy and
Armoring, then in-game they can work well together, or clash.
That is part of why I turned around the spirit giving it a positive focus.
I felt that the idea of the unknown hero becoming a revered ancestor is
pure dunmer and ES too. And we know from the Heart of Lorkan that parts
of the great spirits may live on - in this case the nature of a spirit
that is likely not as powerful as a Lorkhan by an order of magnitude
might still diffuse among the people of Khedal and give them a boost
that is significant in mortal terms.
Why do the Chimer turn to metallurgy eh? They learn skills from the
Dwemer, fine ... but the Dwemer will not part with their secrets to
slaves ... But if they feel that they are indeed faced with 'superior
beings' they might have a basic urge to impress. And by infusing a tiny
part the Spirit of Kedal into the Chimer you give them just a touch of
the immortal, you have something that will feel superior. Very dunmer
too
As for Joe Venice's piece, that is tasty description, and I hope that
he will want to turn his talents to expanding on the Chimer and the
Spirit theme - if Steinaech would like to take the story I have offered
as a starting point then I will give the little idea I have been
holding back to his Joeliness and I do believe he will find it rich
pickings - there is a most excellent model already waiting and and the
barest bones of a story connected to it that needs the master touch.
[edit] heh, just realised that there is a major quest that I have been
looking for a place for that can work here too. it all depends...
[/edit]
But first the big S will have to do his homework... his city really has the makings, now it is down to specific choices.
Wonder what he is doing now? Maybe setting the dates for various events and stages of construction in the buildings in his model? As
in so and so found the cave in the year ..date.. and ... now this is
the first house / structure that was built. It was made by ..name.. in
exactly/approx the year ..date.. etc That's just one style - sometimes it is better to leave stuff vague even when you have a precise date in mind
. I still have to decide to tie in loads of stuff date-wise, or make a
note to the project leaders about getting the 'expert dater' to do
that. It's one thing that a good Lore Meister is so very essential for.
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This post has been edited 6 time(s), it was last edited by raggidman: 2006.11.03 00:30.
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2006.11.02 10:59 |
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Steinaech
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.07.20
Posts: 164
Location: South Carolina
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| quote: |
| Wonder what he is doing now? Maybe setting the dates for various events and stages of building in his model? |
What?
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2006.11.02 23:32 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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2006.11.03 00:20 |
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Steinaech
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.07.20
Posts: 164
Location: South Carolina
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So are we talking about creating models for the buildings rather than the shacks and farm houses?
Oh and what is bob#####?
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2006.11.03 00:24 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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2006.11.03 00:43 |
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Steinaech
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.07.20
Posts: 164
Location: South Carolina
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There is a small ravine type of thing in the middle of the city called
the River of Corpses, as you will see why once you see it if you have
not already, so it is possible for wood that way.
I now see the skeletons in the Hall of Ancients, which is the a dungeon
you must pass through to get to the city as the ones that have been
infused with the spirit but have died. So, when someone dies, they are
sent to the Hall of Ancients where [here comes some of my weird stuff]
their flesh and organs are "ripped" from their body, leaving nothing
but the bones of which are passed through a ritual which reanimates the
skeleton as a Protector of Kedal. |
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2006.11.03 01:04 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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The ravine type thing sounds like it might do the job - there might be some wood gathering quests there.
A dark vision indeed. But if you travel that route then you lose the
possible benefits of a unique source of magical affinity for your
people...
Kedal is a Dark Elve community that lies beneath Soluthis. They have a
very dark past and few dare to venture far beneath Soluthis to reach
it. Spell bound by a dark wizard, they are forbidden to leave their
town and have never seen daylight for over 1,000 years. They are under
constant siege of the Guardians of the Dark Oasis of which the Dark
Wizard has broken open the portal to. Out of this, the Kedalins have
become some of the best wizards and smiths that anybody has ever known.
Some have found this secret underground city, but few have returned to
tell of it.
Have to ask about Soluthis - thought this was a Cavern in the mountains...?
The history you have in your what is it thread does not add up with the
replies to your history thread I now see - 'pologies for not spotting
that before.
Would have thought that the skeletons were the Guardians of the Dark
Oasis, but I guess you have had other thoughts and plans there too.
Are the skeletons placed there by the action of the wizard or by the Kedalins themselves?
Suggest a map of the city - if you can do one as a screenie it might help people inderstand a bit better.
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Editor and Core The Elsweyr Confederacy
Editor and Core Valenwood
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2006.11.03 01:42 |
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Steinaech
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.07.20
Posts: 164
Location: South Carolina
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I'm not the one that decided to put it in Soluthis
The giant Lich is a Guardian
The skeletons are protectors
As of right now there is also a Giant Lich as the Guardian of the Dark
Oasis and Skeletons as warriors of that, but the Lich will probably
change to a Wrath or something.
I posted a rough draft of the History of the Hall of Ancients in the new Literature section, check it out.
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2006.11.03 01:53 |
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raggidman
Prince
Registration Date: 2006.01.06
Posts: 3,326
Location: where my heart is
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Here is a link to the Soluthis Thread in TES3 ST where bob###### is still deciding how to go about modding the City.
I have given him a link to the Chimer and the Spirit Thread in Lit Dev,
and hopefully he can incorporate that into his thinking along with your
concepts for Kedal ... we shall see.
Anyhows I believe that you both have to know what the other is doing so
that TES3 and TES4 both make sense in each other's terms.
I believe bob##### mentioned he would be delighted to have Kedal in TES3 too if that interest you at some point?
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Editor and Core The Elsweyr Confederacy
Editor and Core Valenwood
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2006.11.05 20:45 |
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but hey, I can dream, and learn a lot from the screenies you gave.
... 
- hmm I shall edit me - one moment...
One thing I have now done is to include your Wizard's Curse in the Chimer and the Spirit tale