 (City Council » Factions) Factions |
Ebonyknight
Seigneur
Registration Date: 2006.02.04
Posts: 962
Location: Canada, Ontario
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I'm curious how you are going to go about on factions?
Are you going for guilds or factions?
Me personally factions would suit High Rock a lot better. You could say
join a Knight Order or join of the Lords man and work for him doing
dirty work attacks skirmishes trading helping traders protecting his
settlements being rewarded a piece of land and a manor and you the
works?
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Beware I am Shadow I am the darkness in the corner waiting for you to
take your mind off things for a moment then I strike without hesitation
and leave no trail
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2006.09.23 16:59 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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I believe we'll still end up having Fighters'/Mages'/Thieves' guilds,
just because they're fairly standard in all Tamriel. And, the two
former are Imperially chartered.
Don't worry about factions though. 
I think we'll have those covered. It's High Rock, after all. That said, we haven't done much talking yet about these things.
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2006.09.23 17:02 |
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Arbiter
Archduke
Registration Date: 2005.10.24
Posts: 2,822
Location: Croatia the Nether-Bringer
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We? So there's a hidden team out there somewhere?
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2006.09.23 17:23 |
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Arbiter
Archduke
Registration Date: 2005.10.24
Posts: 2,822
Location: Croatia the Nether-Bringer
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Hrafnkel
Well there is a core. Gyssar better not take credity for all that planning and stuff prior to getting the board!
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Haha yeah. 
Forgot about you guys.
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2006.09.23 17:31 |
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Braggi
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.09.23
Posts: 170
Location: B.C. Canada
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Here's a couple of faction ideas, just to add some input. I realize
that the major factions have been stated, however, what anbout minor,
one-ortwo shot quest factions?
Fer instance, according to "The Daggefall Chronicles" (old hintbook for
TES 2) each of the major cities has a knightly order (Knights of the
Dragon for Daggerfall, Knights of the White Rose for Wayrest and so on.)
1. Why not set up one-shot knightly quest for each city's ruler,
similar in nature perhaps to the "Knights of the White Stallion"
mission in Cyrodil? This could also be useful for Knightly orders for
any of the current towns that survived the Warp in the West.
2. Temple quests... Oblivion needs a few of those, so why not in High Rock?
3. I have an idea for a Thieve's guild quest, if such is wanted.
It's based on a p+p adventure I wrote myself and would likely adapt
easy enough... could even provide the thiefly player with a possible
house/home through the guild. Could be part of the faction advancement
line for middle to upper levels.
4. What about the Mines of Khuras? I don't mean the exact thing
from TES 1, but perhaps a smaller, more thematic homage to the
original. I could say dittoe to the Crypt of Hearts as well and various
factions might have interplay with these and other locations. As a
matter of fact, one of these could be a major concern for the ruling
factions of one or more of the High Rock principlaities.
5. Since High Rock is so magic oriented, there should likely be
related small factions (again for short quest sand the like). Examples:
a) An Alchemist's faction with rare ingredient quests.
b) A bardic college with two small quests open to all and a
faction rating for completing them, similar to "Order of the Virtueous
Blood".
Stuff to chew on... thoughts?
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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Braggi: 2006.09.23 21:06.
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2006.09.23 20:59 |
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Arbiter
Archduke
Registration Date: 2005.10.24
Posts: 2,822
Location: Croatia the Nether-Bringer
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I really like that Temple (or Church perhaps?) faction and Bard's have always been neglected.
Of course, Orders are great as long as they're not easy to join or are there just as content-fillers.
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2006.09.23 21:08 |
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DarkAsmodeous
King of the Kittens
Registration Date: 2006.05.25
Posts: 5,338
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Merchants are a large aspect of the politics here, so sea faring merchants are a must.
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2006.09.23 23:09 |
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Ebonyknight
Seigneur
Registration Date: 2006.02.04
Posts: 962
Location: Canada, Ontario
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Merchant Guild
Fighters Guild
Mages Guild
Knight Orders
Lord/King factions
Thieves Guild
What else?
__________________
Some say I'm here, Others say I'm there, but really... I am every where
Beware I am Shadow I am the darkness in the corner waiting for you to
take your mind off things for a moment then I strike without hesitation
and leave no trail
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2006.09.23 23:13 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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I think there should also be an Orsinium faction
(ah, I know most people forget the orcs
except me and a few, but I'm the core member or co-leader with
juristiction over Nova Orsinium 
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but let's see....
I was at first thinking a faction for every tribe and clan but that'd
be too many... so I thought of narrowing it down.... I was thinking in
Orsinium, you can join the army... and a smithy guild... and also a
Temple faction....
so for Nova Orsinium, I think the 3 factions would be...
Orsinium Army
Trinimac Temple
Armorers Guild
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2006.09.25 13:59 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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I really don't think anyone's forgetting the orcs. They just don't need
to have half the factions in High Rock, or it will look like it's an
"Orsinium and a few other places" mod.
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2006.09.25 14:48 |
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Shadow
Baron
Registration Date: 2006.09.10
Posts: 328
Location: Thessalonica,Maketho
nia,Greece
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Where does the evil come in!?
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2006.09.25 15:01 |
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Gyssar
Seigneur
Registration Date: 2006.09.07
Posts: 214
Location: Moscow, Russia
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There won't be anything "evil" in this mod, it's gonna be centred around the power struggle of the local political forces.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Hrafnkel
The mighty Gyssar knows all.
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2006.09.25 15:04 |
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Shadow
Baron
Registration Date: 2006.09.10
Posts: 328
Location: Thessalonica,Maketho
nia,Greece
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Politics screams evil to me 
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2006.09.25 15:06 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Hrafnkel
I really don't think anyone's forgetting the orcs. They just don't need
to have half the factions in High Rock, or it will look like it's an
"Orsinium and a few other places" mod. |
that's why I suggested three faction ideas that I felt could be in...
which is why I said
"I think there should also be an Orsinium faction "
which could either be...
"Orsinium Army
Trinimac Temple
Armorers Guild"
those were my ideas... not to have half the factions as orcish ones...
Hraf, please if you are going to attack me for my ideas or criticize
them with whatever intention, please at least understand my thinking...
I only meant ONE orcish faction, and suggested three possible
candidates... and you apparently thought I wanted three joinable
factions... I hope this doesn't end on a bad note but I want to make it
clear before anyone else comments on my idea, but doesn't understand my
meaning...
and if you guys don't understand me, please ask, don't assume... arguements start with misunderstanding 
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2006.09.25 17:20 |
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Braggi
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.09.23
Posts: 170
Location: B.C. Canada
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The Orsinium faction you mentioned...
I noticed in OB that you usually didn't directly join a politcal
faction, but rather a group that represents them. You join to Blades to
represent the Empire in the MQ for OB, as one example and I guess the
knight-errant quests for the Count of Leyawin would be another.
The orcs have a very different culture from the rest of High Rock.
Bretons are magical in society and culture (some lore claims druidic),
whereas the orcs are more up-front and in you face warriors. That means
their cultural institutions and groups will be different too. Any
thoughts on what the group might like be that would represent Orsniium?
A knighthood? Some other kind of group. You mentioned the army as a
possibility. (I'm thinking of something along the line of the imperial
legion quests in MW as a possible model, but with an orcish spin.)
Also, another faction that was prevalent as a minor player in DF would
be the witch covens. Those are mentioned in current game lore (see the
reference made to one of them in the book "The Warp in the West" in
OB.) Many of them could be tied in to new and/or unused artifact
quests, as one possibility, since that's one of the main way you got
them in DF. OB used Daedra shrines, and I suppose the covens would be
the HR paralell to them. However, there's no reason they couldn't have
their own interests aside from artifacts too.
Finally, would anyone be interested in a list of possible factions
culled from DF? There was an old, command-line based (modder-created)
tool for helping you figure out where your PC stood with the factions
in the game. This also helped diagnose quest bugs, such as when folks
would stop talking to you for some reason. I'm pretty sure I still have
a copy archived in my DF utilities and would be happy to compile a list
for folks to play with.
The idea would be not to duplicate DF, but to get inspiration from the
situation before the Warp. With such massive change having occurred,
nothing is going to be left untouched. the faction structure would
certainly be radically altered with so many deaths and the political
changes of the Warp.
Let me know on this one, OK?
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"Stop hitting that key... there is no Escape."
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Braggi: 2006.09.25 20:28.
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2006.09.25 20:27 |
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Arbiter
Archduke
Registration Date: 2005.10.24
Posts: 2,822
Location: Croatia the Nether-Bringer
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Yeah, I agree with that more direct approach to Orc faction, if only on the outside.
Witch covens... like Order of Virtous Blood perhaps?
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2006.09.25 20:31 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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I agree with your idea for an Orcish faction...
but was thinking along the lines of the main themes of the Nova Orsinium... military, orc armorers, and the new religion...
but perhaps there will be unjoinable factions like the Temple of Trinimac...
so what about a 'Orsinium Army' faction... I like it best out of all of
them, maybe the 'armorers guild' can even be merged into it... an all
around military faction, emphasizing combat and such... a group that is
honorable, but not afraid of confrontation, and is more tied with a
government than a normal guild |
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2006.09.25 20:35 |
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Braggi
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.09.23
Posts: 170
Location: B.C. Canada
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Arbiter:
The witch covens could want to hunt vampires, as one possibvility.
However, I think they would also be interested in various things
concerning Nirn's welfare directly. I wondered when playing DF if the
covens were there as survivals of the old druidic order mentioned in
some of the lore at the time.
For that matter, it might bear looking into to see if there was a
druidic order in DF of some type. If the druids were part of the
pre-empire HR groups, then they may still be lurking around in the
background, looking for an opportunity to reassert themselves in the
affairs of the land. The Warp would both help and hinder that.
KuKulza: Would it be nosy of me to ask you to expand a bit upon
the Temple of Trinimac? I've read a little about the orcish religion
though books and such in-game. How do you envision it?
A couple of specfic questions I'm curious about :
a) Does the orcish temple have a strong relationship with the governement or is it more concerned with religious affairs only?
b) If it does influence the rulers, how does it do so and what kind of things would happen as a result.
Heck, all three of the groups you mentioned would likely have their
hands in on any Orsinium plotline of quests. You might want to make a
combined, unique faction for the orcs with different rank titles based
on who's quests you complete. You would simply have to figure out which
group was where in the orcish hierarchy and then design your quest line
on that.
E.G.: You do two army quests successfully and get a rank in the overall
faction. As a result, the temple notices you and gets you to do some
thing for them, resulting in a new rank. This in turn makes you famous
enough in that faction to get the rulers interested. Succeed for them
and a third rank is bestowed. One faction to keep it simple, but all
three groups bestow titles, ranks and so forth.
These are just ideas, of course, take whatever works and use it, ignore the rest.
__________________
Bard out...
"Stop hitting that key... there is no Escape."
This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Braggi: 2006.09.25 20:53.
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2006.09.25 20:51 |
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Arbiter
Archduke
Registration Date: 2005.10.24
Posts: 2,822
Location: Croatia the Nether-Bringer
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I meant how Covens would act as factions, not what they would really do.
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2006.09.25 20:54 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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@ Braggi:
that is an intriguing thought... perhaps I will see if that can be arranged...
the Temple of Trinimac was started by Gortwog the King, so it obviously it VERY tied with the politics...
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2006.09.25 21:07 |
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Braggi
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.09.23
Posts: 170
Location: B.C. Canada
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KuKulzA:
I'm delighted if my ideas are useful. Inspiration is always a welcome
thing and I am happy to help out. As I mentioned, use and adapt
whatever works. The goal is to have fun, after all.
Arbiter: Whoops. My enthusiasm runneth over again. (Sorry about
that.) Yes, in that sense it would be like the Order of the Virtuous
Blood. Those smaller, one-or-two shot factions really add to the game.
Plus they act like awards of merit and a history for your PC - you get
to see what you've done to affect the world directly.
Thanks for the replies, gang. I'm really enjoying the conversation here.
__________________
Bard out...
"Stop hitting that key... there is no Escape."
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2006.09.25 21:33 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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| quote: |
Originally posted by KuKulzA
could be... I doubt he wants Trinimac religion to seem oppressive...
but I don't think the religion wants to tolerate Malacath worship or
witch covens undermining it...
so like a Trinimac-Templar faction... obviously cambat/religious
oriented, which includes a but of magica and armory... could work...
could work...
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He's smart enough to implement an order of that nature without making
it seem like he's being oppressive. He could probably even make it look
like the Malacath cults are being aggressive.
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2006.09.25 21:52 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Hrafnkel
| quote: |
Originally posted by KuKulzA
could be... I doubt he wants Trinimac religion to seem oppressive...
but I don't think the religion wants to tolerate Malacath worship or
witch covens undermining it...
so like a Trinimac-Templar faction... obviously cambat/religious
oriented, which includes a but of magica and armory... could work...
could work...
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He's smart enough to implement an order of that nature without making
it seem like he's being oppressive. He could probably even make it look
like the Malacath cults are being aggressive. |
hmm... I agree....
although malacath does take care of Orcs... those that follow him tend
to be dark arts type or a bit on the crazy berserk side....
maybe they show they are good by helping the poor and driving away
witches and bringing education... maybe even by NOT attacking Cults and
just letting the cults do their own thing but discouraging it....
I mean the disgust (in Orsinium) towards Malacath is fairly recent...
not everyone REALLY hates him, they are just kinda doubting Malacath
and sort of seeing a good possibility in Trinimac...
I was just wondering though on a side-note...
the worship of the Aedric Eight Divines gives them a form and following...
so will intense worship of Trinimac make him 'appear'? 
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2006.09.25 21:58 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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| quote: |
Originally posted by KuKulzA
hmm... I agree....
although malacath does take care of Orcs... those that follow him tend
to be dark arts type or a bit on the crazy berserk side....
maybe they show they are good by helping the poor and driving away
witches and bringing education... maybe even by NOT attacking Cults and
just letting the cults do their own thing but discouraging it....
I mean the disgust (in Orsinium) towards Malacath is fairly recent...
not everyone REALLY hates him, they are just kinda doubting Malacath
and sort of seeing a good possibility in Trinimac...
I was just wondering though on a side-note...
the worship of the Aedric Eight Divines gives them a form and following...
so will intense worship of Trinimac make him 'appear'?
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That's what I'm saying. Gortwog can easily frame Malacath cults for all
sorts of aggressive things. People can overlook the helping the poor
and all if they think it's a front. It would be beneficial for him to
make the Malacath cults look destructive.
As for the last thing you said... I dunno what you're on about. Might be the wording you used.
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2006.09.25 22:03 |
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KuKulzA
King
Registration Date: 2005.09.07
Posts: 7,891
Location: USA / Taiwan
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yeah the last thing I said was kinda weird, it won't be discussed in this topic, bad place for it...
so let us see...
maybe it is like a sort of Hezzbollah... except legal...
it doesn't directly answer to Gortwog, but does follow him, promotes
Trinimac, helps spread education to places the Orsinium gov't is having
a tough time, and is liek the Templar Knights in the sense that they
are protecting people, and they get donations from the Orsinium
government.
but how about a certain catch.
maybe this faction is at odds with another. Let's say.... witch
coverns, or Fighters Guild... or the Mages Guild... who knows...
there are however two themes in Nova Orsinium, the older tribal
life-style, the newer more man-influenced civilization life-style...
influenced by man in the sense that they are trying to make themselves
acceptable to Cyrodiil...
but I don't know if we should make this an orc exclusive thing...
how about a Trinimac faction. They worship Trinimac, but not as the
Temple does. Maybe they are a faction with its roots in the Trinimac
worship, that way it isn't a JUST Orsinium thing, but something can
spread farther around... though concentrated in the Orsinium
territory... so maybe Wayrest has a few Trinimac-faction-members... and
maybe a few places in Evermore's territory etc.
just a thought
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2006.09.25 22:43 |
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Ebonyknight
Seigneur
Registration Date: 2006.02.04
Posts: 962
Location: Canada, Ontario
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To me you guys and the public. Covens dont sound applying. K say this
for you guys. High rock join Mages guild Fighters guild Covens yeaya.
Or you could have High rock: join Mages Guild Fighters Guild Knights
Politics Religion step outside of the Bethseda thinking circle and back
into the olden days of Factions. Factions run the world not some coven
who is killing a small animal. I am also wrong cus some covens are
powerful just like to be left alone so I suggest and I will help if you
guys step into a European Style Mod where it does revolve around
trading building war assassins politics making the right choice be
honest High Rock is the Europe of Tamriel.
__________________
Some say I'm here, Others say I'm there, but really... I am every where
Beware I am Shadow I am the darkness in the corner waiting for you to
take your mind off things for a moment then I strike without hesitation
and leave no trail
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2006.09.26 00:07 |
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Braggi
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.09.23
Posts: 170
Location: B.C. Canada
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Ebonyknight: I wasn't thinking of covens as a major faction for joinging purposes. More as a simple one shot.
Also, factions that are not joinable do affect your reputation with
various people in the world. A coven member might have major interests
in getting certain rare ingredients shipped over from other parts of
the continent, so you run a short quest for him or her and your
reputqtion improves marginally for the related merchant faction they
deal with. More along the lines of background stuff then out-front
guilds.
That way the main factions stay in the spotlight, where they belong,
but you still have some interesting side things to play with. Or, the
quest might add a single point of fame or infamy to your total - not
enough to unbalance anything, but it lets you know you made some kind
of a difference to the world.
Regarding the European idea, well, I think we're pretty much in agreement there.
__________________
Bard out...
"Stop hitting that key... there is no Escape."
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2006.09.26 00:37 |
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Danmako
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.10.25
Posts: 104
Location: Australia...MATE
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YES YES YES
European style succession politics would make High Rock stand out as
the premium political conflict area and would, in my opinion set this
project far above the others
Battles for hereditary right where players must choose sides are the real meat here
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Danmako....The man with no name
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2006.10.30 06:14 |
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DarkAsmodeous
King of the Kittens
Registration Date: 2006.05.25
Posts: 5,338
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I'm am in disagreement.
Factions, while in a political sense are as you defined them, but we
are moding for the player, and we want to give the player the
opportunity to be who he wishes to be, thusly I hold that there should
be more factions that those related to politics.
__________________
The soul's condition is learning to fly
Condition grounded, but determined to try
Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies
Toung-tied and twisted, just an Earth-bound misfit, I
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2006.10.30 06:21 |
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Danmako
First Knight
Registration Date: 2006.10.25
Posts: 104
Location: Australia...MATE
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HA! NEVER!
No only kidding, of course there should be, I'm just saying that it
really would set it apart to have these factions as the main meat of
the province. Players could ignore them but would find conflict
erupting around them
Are there any particular factions announced oother than FG, MG and TG?
I would personally love to see the noble orders reinstated, but once
you join one (certain amount of fame needed?) you wouldn't be able to
join another?
__________________
Danmako....The man with no name
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2006.10.30 06:42 |
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Hrafnkel
Count
Registration Date: 2006.08.01
Posts: 861
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There's other factions planned. Knights of the Dragon, Knights of the
Rose, and Knights of the Boar (great house-like in that you can only
join one), the League of Rogues, the Akatosh Chantry, and the Temple of
Kynareth.
__________________
Your monkeys dance on the Tower and the stars change and you do not remember.
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2006.10.30 07:26 |
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