 The Order of Oak and Thorn |
Siegfried
Archduke
Registration Date: 07.03.2006
Posts: 2,598
Location: With Your Mom...
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| The Order of Oak and Thorn |
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Alright, lets talk factions.
The Order of Oak and Thorn is an organization or Nordic Druids,
Shamans, hunters, and Rangers responsible for carrying out the various
religious rituals and ceremonies that compose the Nordic Faith.
Generally, these ceremonies are carried out in rings of standing stones
deep within the forests of Skyrim.
So lets kick around some ideas, what would people like to see in this faction?
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15.06.2007 08:40 |
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Psychotic
Jarl of Skyrim
Registration Date: 30.07.2006
Posts: 3,420
Location: Sheogorath's Realm
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Before I add ideas of my own I have a few questions:
- What is the purpose of the order? Do they seek to spiritually guide
the people of Skyrim or do they do what they do only for themselves?
- If the order does serve the people to some extent how do they (the
people) interact with the order and how do they participate in the
rituals of the order (Do they go to the local stone circle on Sundas to
dance and drink in honor of the gods? 
)?
- Does the order claim to be able to communicate with the gods and if so is this claim real?
- Does the order favor one Nordic god over all other or are they all equally worshiped and respected?
- In Nordic lore only shamans are mentioned (AFAIK), what's the difference between shamans and druids?
- What kind of a role do rangers play in the order?
- Precisely what kind of rituals and ceremonies does the order perform (A ritual for a longer summer perhaps?)?
- Can the powers of the order be related to magic or is there another
way of explaining it (since magic is not very popular with Nords)?
- Is there a conflict between The Order of Oak and Thorn and the Mages'
Guild/Imperial Cult? If there is one what exactly is the source of that
conflict (a question with an obvious answer perhaps)?
That's all the questions I can think of atm, I hope they will inspire some creative answers. 
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15.06.2007 22:38 |
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Alasdair
Jarl of Skyrim
Registration Date: 29.08.2006
Posts: 1,169
Location: Somerset, England
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Psychotic
- Is there a conflict between The Order of Oak and Thorn and the Mages'
Guild/Imperial Cult? If there is one what exactly is the source of that
conflict (a question with an obvious answer perhaps)? |
I'd image there would be conflict with the imperial cult for the same
reason the Tribunal temple and the imperial cult weren't best of
buddies in Morrowind. Essentially they worship different gods/different
versions of the same gods, and they will inevitably disagree with each
other. |
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15.06.2007 22:47 |
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As I said ages ago, this faction needed to be split up, because the
gods of the Skyrim pantheon are worshipped sepeartely (which is in
lore).
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16.06.2007 01:09 |
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Siegfried
Archduke
Registration Date: 07.03.2006
Posts: 2,598
Location: With Your Mom...
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First off great questions Psychotic, they are all things necessary to be asked, and now my brain is going.
| quote: |
Originally posted by Psychotic
Before I add ideas of my own I have a few questions:
- What is the purpose of the order? Do they seek to spiritually guide
the people of Skyrim or do they do what they do only for themselves?
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The Order's purpose is to some extent to guide and educate the people
about the gods, but at their core their purpose is more "practical".
They understand "Runemaul"-- the knowledge of how to wield the power of
runes. They use there powers to look after the people of Skyrim-- heal
the sick, look into the future, and when necessity calls, combat evil.
| quote: |
| -
If the order does serve the people to some extent how do they (the
people) interact with the order and how do they participate in the
rituals of the order (Do they go to the local stone circle on Sundas to
dance and drink in honor of the gods?
)? |
Frankly I haven't thought that out too much. I think to some extent the
Order preaches to the lay-people at the places of meeting, and
instructs them in the various rituals that compose Skyrim religion
(dancing around stones, sacrifices, how to please the gods, ect, ect)
| quote: |
| - Does the order claim to be able to communicate with the gods and if so is this claim real? |
The Order claims to carry out the will of the gods more or less-- the
validity of the claim is up to debate, to some extent they do, but
because of the nature of the Aedra and how withdrawn they are from the
day-to-day lives of men, it's difficult to truly tell. About direct
communication, it's on an individual basis, generally seers are
considered to be in communication with the gods, some are, and others
are just frauds.
| quote: |
| - Does the order favor one Nordic god over all other or are they all equally worshiped and respected? |
As a whole the order does not favor a specific god, however regionally
different groups are devoted to different deities-- sort of like
different cathedrals around Cyrodiil are each devoted to a different
member of the Nine.
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| - In Nordic lore only shamans are mentioned (AFAIK), what's the difference between shamans and druids? |
Good question, I guess they are more or less synonymous in many cases,
traditionally though in the real world, leaders of the Nordic, Anglo,
and Saxon pagan faiths were refered to as Druids-- Shaman was more a
thing from other groups, so that's the reason I included them I guess.
If they are not referenced in lore, than they won't be in our mod most
likely, I was just throwing out ideas.
| quote: |
| - What kind of a role do rangers play in the order? |
The Order is not an exclusive ranger thing. Rather, the nature of the
Order, and their connection with the "wild", means they generally work
hand in hand with rangers. I guess let me use an analogy with the real
world to better illustrate the connection. In RL, the Christian Church
and Salvation Army often work hand in hand, however, they are two
seperate entities, yet in many cases salvo workers are active members
in the church-- this is because they have similar goals, and the two
organizations can help eachother achieve those goals. The same goes for
the order, they commune a great deal with nature, and the rangers spend
lots of time in nature, so taking some of the order's teachings and
applying it to their everyday lives can prove very useful. I'm not sure
I was too clear there, if you have more specific questions, I would be
happy to ellaborate
| quote: |
| - Precisely what kind of rituals and ceremonies does the order perform (A ritual for a longer summer perhaps?)? |
These vary a great deal-- some things like a ritual for a longers
summer, another could be a ceremony to please a specific god before
warriors go off to battle, communing with animals and trees, hosting a
harvest feast to thank the gods for their bounty, a ritual to heal a
man from an illness, making an offering to appease a vengeful spirit,
or really anything regarding runes and wielding their power.
| quote: |
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Can the powers of the order be related to magic or is there another way
of explaining it (since magic is not very popular with Nords)? |
Members of the Order are adept in the use of magic, however, it is
generally not something they use a great deal-- and when magic is used
it is generally used to augment their existing capabilities, and are
used on themselves, not placed on others. Rather, what members of the
Order do are create potions to empower themselves, tame beasts to fight
for them, craft powerful runes to augment themselves (I'll go into
runes in detail in a seperate post later), or via rituals call on the
elements, ancestor spirits, and nature to battle their foes.
| quote: |
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Is there a conflict between The Order of Oak and Thorn and the Mages'
Guild/Imperial Cult? If there is one what exactly is the source of that
conflict (a question with an obvious answer perhaps)? |
Yes, there is a very deep divide between the Order and the Mages Guild,
at the heart of which is the mage's desire to learn how to wield the
power of runes, the Order's most jealously guarded secret. There is
some conflict between the Order and Imperial Cult, however, this more
minor and restrained, nothing compared to the quarrel with the mages.
They more or less worship the same deities, but look at them
differently. Different interpretations so to speak-- its more like the
difference between Christian Denominations, they acknowledge their
common roots, but differ philosophically.
Alasdair's comment also brings up a good point about the two sides--
here is the fundamental difference in their views on magic use. The
Order of Oak and Thorn believes that when magicka is used, it should be
to bring the wielder into tune with the natural world, so that they can
work as one to achieve their objective. The Mages on the otherhand,
believe that magic should be used as a method by which to put the
wielder in control of the natural world, as a means to reach an end.
Lastly, @ TOYB:
Ideally the faction could be split up into several sub-groups. However,
that is unrealistic from a work-load standpoint if the "Order" is ever
to be joinable. To compromise, different halls/chapels/or whatever the
meeting places/regional branches of the Order are referred to are
devoted to specific deities, but they all kind of cooperate with
eachother, share ideas, knowledge, ect. This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Siegfried: 16.06.2007 07:18.
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16.06.2007 07:16 |
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Siegfried
Archduke
Registration Date: 07.03.2006
Posts: 2,598
Location: With Your Mom...
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Anyone got suggestions for an initiation quest? I'd like to come up
with something very unique to get into the Order. Perhaps a 2 part
thing? You start off doing something to gain their trust (any generic
mission could work here), and a Shaman and some rangers on a hunt for
some sacred beast, and once its caught you take its heart and make an
offering of it on the alter of Shor or something?
Any other suggestions?
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30.06.2007 22:17 |
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cruxvader
Seigneur
Registration Date: 17.05.2006
Posts: 155
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No, many dieties, many factions based on their take of the whole view/
spectrum. That doesn't mean they all are at war, but it does mean that
they all have some sort of difference.
If you want an example, look at real world religions, and how divided one becomes.
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30.06.2007 23:58 |
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