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morcroft · 03-24-2010, 08:01 PM,

Something I noticed back in TES 3 that I don't think they've fixed is that when you <ctrl>D to duplicate items it's the original object that stays selected. Dumb beyond belief because it practically guarantees you'll make a dirty mod! The only solution is to use <ctrl>C <ctrl>V whenever you're duplicating something that's not part of your esp.

***sandor*** · 03-25-2010, 10:11 AM,

Quote:Originally posted by morcroft
Something I noticed back in TES 3 that I don't think they've fixed is that when you <ctrl>D to duplicate items it's the original object that stays selected. Dumb beyond belief because it practically guarantees you'll make a dirty mod! The only solution is to use <ctrl>C <ctrl>V whenever you're duplicating something that's not part of your esp.

That's correct and causing this problem.
It's best to use <ctrl>C & <ctrl>V.

Quote:[quote]Originally posted by Ibsen's Ghost
Does your editing process involve deleting the object in question or simply altering its reference? If it deletes it then it's a bigger issue and may be the reason why some people experienced floating shrooms recently, including myself.

I normally delete the object because it's often only one object (IIRC it happened twice a long time ago).

It's possible to fix it manually but takes a lot of time.

FYI
Deleting an object will not cause floating. :check:
Floating is determined by the placement data (X,Y,Z) and unique for every placed object.

If for some reason the meshes were updated (geometry) it's possible that the mushrooms started to float. I had the same problem when RW updated a ST fern mesh which we used in Steadhelm.

Ibsen's Ghost · 03-25-2010, 06:29 PM,

Nope, it's not that. I'm pretty sure. We haven't updated the tree mesh but if a tree were to be deleted due to this issue and the mushrooms that have been attached to it are not deleted then I would have thought that would be the logical cause. Anyway, it's immaterial.

What's more important is that I tend to use this method often as it's quicker than copy-and-paste. This is because a duplicated set of objects remain at the same level. For Everglades meshes, I use a lot of lilypads and mossy logs and these need to be at water level so they look like they're floating. If you copy and paste them then they'll be pasted in at a different height and it's more awkward to move them back into the position where you want them.

God, why do Bethesda have to make things so bloody difficult? X(

I've duplicated some stuff with my current esm (it's not submitted yet) but do you think it's possible to locate the guilty meshes and sort them out myself, sandor? It might save you a bit of time if you're able to let me know how. There's not that many of the error messages but they do tell you which cell the errors occur in. I'm just not sure if I can locate the precise models it refers to.

morcroft · 03-25-2010, 06:46 PM,

Crazy, isn't it?
I know what you mean about the repositioning problem. I found the thing to do was to use copy-paste for the first item, then duplicate that as many times as you need. As long as you never duplicate an item that isn't part of the esp you're actually working on you're OK.

***sandor*** · 03-27-2010, 09:13 AM,

Quote:Originally posted by Ibsen's Ghost
We haven't updated the tree mesh but if a tree were to be deleted due to this issue and the mushrooms that have been attached to it are not deleted then I would have thought that would be the logical cause.

I thought you were referring to 'normal' mushrooms, I agree.
However I only deleted 2 to 3 objects so if there are many floating mushrooms it's caused by something else.

Quote:Originally posted by Ibsen's Ghost
What's more important is that I tend to use this method often as it's quicker than copy-and-paste. This is because a duplicated set of objects remain at the same level. For Everglades meshes, I use a lot of lilypads and mossy logs and these need to be at water level so they look like they're floating. If you copy and paste them then they'll be pasted in at a different height and it's more awkward to move them back into the position where you want them.

God, why do Bethesda have to make things so bloody difficult? X(

I think morcroft's suggestion works very well.

Quote:Originally posted by Ibsen's Ghost
I've duplicated some stuff with my current esm (it's not submitted yet) but do you think it's possible to locate the guilty meshes and sort them out myself, sandor? It might save you a bit of time if you're able to let me know how. There's not that many of the error messages but they do tell you which cell the errors occur in. I'm just not sure if I can locate the precise models it refers to.

Yes, you have to locate the object (check the editor warnings) and find the corresponding Form ID. Then move it back to the original cell.

As I said before it's often only one object so rechecking the area (after the merge) is faster than finding the object that caused the problem.

Ibsen's Ghost · 03-28-2010, 02:43 PM,

Thanks sandor (and morcroft). I'll take that onboard. :check:

Ibsen's Ghost · 08-27-2010, 09:37 PM,

I'm just logging some of sandor's observations here for reference. The main one is that it is possible to fall through Rottmere's Folly (the bridge over the Everglades). This may be due to Helborne's settings on snap-to-grid.

What I found useful about sandor's advice was that the snap-to-grid settings depends on the modeller. Although the pieces normally snap to the grid with 256 units, it is sometimes 128 or even 512 etc.

I quote sandor below for my own and anyone else's reference to testing this out whenever snap-to-grid is not quite so efficient as it might be:

Quote:To test this create a Test interior cell. Add two pieces and snap these together, if the result was wrong delete the pieces and change the snap setting. Try again. Once you found the correct setting assemble the bridge and copy (CTRL-C, CTRL-V) it to the correct location

Deeza · 08-27-2010, 10:08 PM,

Speaking of Rottmere's Folly, wasn't there going to be an Argonian village built on top of the eastern end of it?

Ibsen's Ghost · 08-27-2010, 10:10 PM,

Yes, Nu-Tlak. However, my thinking was that there would literally only be a hut or two because there's already the marsh house at the other end of the bridge.

Deeza · 08-27-2010, 10:16 PM,

Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. Kind of like one of the bridges on top of the ruined motorway in Fallout 3...

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/File:Arefu.jpg