Gloss, Specular, Shine... how?

[MentalElf]

I've experimented somewhat with the CivIV shader, but can't
seem to get my objects to have shine, gloss, or specularity.

Any help would be appreciated.

MentalElf

[TheImperialDragon]

Originally posted by MentalElf
I've experimented somewhat with the CivIV shader, but can't
seem to get my objects to have shine, gloss, or specularity.

Any help would be appreciated.

MentalElf

From my experience thus far, I believe gloss and specularity are controlled by the Normal maps, and to make it have more gloss or shine, you'll have to increase the opacity of the Normal map. At least, I believe that is how it is done.

[Aorawn]

I assume you're talking about Oblivion? Try it in Morrowind and it just looks like a plastic wrap...

[Axen]

Specular is done automatically by the alpha channel of normal maps. Gloss, not entirely sure.

And normal mapping, specular mapping, etc. don't work in Morrowind because that old version of NIF only contains normal information, not binormal or tangent.

[MentalElf]

Ok, Sorry, yes this is for Oblivion.
I was able to effectively use maps in ESIII to shine decently.

Normal map?
None of the shaders available in my 3DS MAX 6 have such
a map. In addition to the normal set of shaders, there are
vertex colors and custom shaders. I've been using the
"CivilizationIV Shader" for some reason (would this be
more applicable to Oblivion than "Blinn"?). The maps
available to set for this are:

Base (only one I use so far)
Dark
Detail
Decal
Bump
Gloss (tried this, no effect)
Glow
Particle Color
Particle Opacity
Reflection
Bump
Reflection (not sure why there are two of these)
Refraction
Displacement

Note that enabling/disabling "[x] Specular" has no effect in game.
NOTE ALSO: *ALL* autmospheric effects are disabled:

Thanks in advance,
MentalElf

[Hoss]

Originally posted by MentalElf
Ok, Sorry, yes this is for Oblivion.
I was able to effectively use maps in ESIII to shine decently.

Normal map?
None of the shaders available in my 3DS MAX 6 have such
a map. In addition to the normal set of shaders, there are
vertex colors and custom shaders. I've been using the
"CivilizationIV Shader" for some reason (would this be
more applicable to Oblivion than "Blinn"?). The maps
available to set for this are:

Base (only one I use so far)
Dark
Detail
Decal
Bump
Gloss (tried this, no effect)
Glow
Particle Color
Particle Opacity
Reflection
Bump
Reflection (not sure why there are two of these)
Refraction
Displacement

Note that enabling/disabling "[x] Specular" has no effect in game.
NOTE ALSO: *ALL* autmospheric effects are disabled:
Thanks in advance,
MentalElf

THe normal maps are the textures that have an _n after them. If you look in the textures for Oblivion you will see many of them. theses are what give Obliviion its Realistic look. THe oblivion engine automatically applies them. They are named the same as your main texture the just have the _n after them. Look in the construction set wiki for more on normall mapping in the Rettexuring tut.You don't apply them in 3ds Max

But making a normal map is a bit complicated I myself am still trying to understand it!

[Razorwing]

The gloss can be controlled in NifSkope, but I haven't experimented successfully with that option.

Let's take "Oblivion\Data\Meshes\landscape\clams01.nif" for example. Open it in NifSkope and unroll the NiTriStrips tree, letting you see the block "10 NiMaterialProperty". You'll probably recognize the name of the block, "1 - Default", and like the name suggests the block holds data set up in Max's material editor. Doubleclick the palette icon and you'll get a popup window letting you affect various material editor settings. Among others, Gloss. Presumably Bethesda set these things up in Max using the real exporter's shader, but since we can't, we have to use NifSkope.

Gloss and specular often go hand in hand. It's quite possible you need a normal/specular map first to be able to affect the glossiness.

I've never been able to successfully use any other texturing technique than color/opacity maps in an Oblivion model through 3D Studio Max. I've experimented a lot on that, and nope, only the color map settings and opacity settings can be exported directly from Max. The opacity is only possible to export with Civ4, not NifTools. Well, you *can* export a bump map with Civ4, but the model will lack height and look worse, so there's no point.

[MentalElf]

Ok!

Created two 512x512 maps to match the two texture maps.
Edited them to be kind of a light blue alpha map of one texture.
Put in my textures directory with the "_n.dds" suffix.
Results! ! !


Now all I need for this simple work to continue
is to sort out the collision mesh problem of being
too short.

[MentalElf]

What parameter on the "_n.dds" map controls how much
gloss? Is it brightness? More bright = more gloss?

Thanks in advance,
MentalElf

[Razorwing]

Originally posted by MentalElf
What parameter on the "_n.dds" map controls how much
gloss? Is it brightness? More bright = more gloss?

Thanks in advance,
MentalElf

I think it's a material editor setting.

You can manipulate it in NifSkope, by unrolling the nif tree and doubleclicking on the appropriate material block. You'll recognize it from the palette icon.

Hope it helps.