Polycounts and texture budgets

[sHAdowgAme]

does anyone know what the average poly/vertex count is at any given time in ES4?
I was also curious as what the average size of the textures was, as I am about to begin the baking process for many of my models.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

I'm crap with polies, I'm afraid. I tend to lean heavily on Koniption for that.

Textures are a different matter. Just looking into the 'Ayleid ruins' folder brings up a set of textures for those dungeons which would roughly equate with your Hist Shrine models. All ES4 textures must be divisible by 128 pixels so you get some really small textures for small items. If I remember rightly though, you can't have textures which are something like 256x640 (even though both are still divisible by 128) but I could be wrong as it just didn't work for me the last time I did something like that. However, most of the Ayleid ruin textures are about 512x512 and that comes out at about 170kb per texture (not including the normal maps).

[Lady Nerevar]

all textures must be powers of 2. the average texture is 512*512, going up to 512*1024 for more detailed items (tapestries and some clothing). there may be one or two 1024*1024 textures, but they are pretty rare.

the average triangle count really depends on what you are modeling. i don't have the CS on hand atm, but judging by some of my previous estimates, clutter is about 500-1k in size. i recall weapons being something around 2k. for architecture, i'd keep it as low as humanly possible, since exterior cells tend to draw the most resources.

[Koniption]

Yes, listen to what Lady Nerevar said.

I think some buildings used in the TES4 exterior world can be up to 15, 000 triangles; but I wouldn't go over that amount, and would definitely try to trim off as many triangles as I could from that.

The 15,000 triangle amount also refers to a more complicated building than usual, and not the more simple pieces.

For instance, your separate Hist ruins wall maze pieces, should probably be no more than 70 to 150 triangles, and that's if they have extra 3D details that absolutely need to be included aside from the main shape (a box/rectangle shape, basically - aka 12 triangles at its simplest form). If we're gonna make a maze from many of those ruin pieces, then the above limit I stated should suffice. Some pieces can have more triangles if they're more complicated, though. Like that tree you're modeling - I would try to stay at 15,000 triangles or below (since trees are more complicated structures), including everything in that 15,000 triangle goal (leaves, trunk, branches, other details). If one tree is going to be used overall in the middle of the ruin maze, *maybe* more triangles can be used. But if unsure don't go over 20,000 triangles.

Koniption

[sHAdowgAme]

Thanks all. I guess a 2048^2 texture is out of the question.
Bummer.

[Lady Nerevar]

there really is no need to make a texture that size. i did a test once, using 512*, 1024*, and 2048* sized textures on the same wall. there was a difference between 512 and 1024, but between 1028 and 2048 the difference was almost entirely nonexistent. it is much better to use two 1024 textures and have them tile if you must use that amount of space.

[sHAdowgAme]

Most games made with the Unreal 3 engine use 2048's. It does make a difference. The textures are so crisp, even up close. Though I do see your point.

[Lady Nerevar]

takes up a lot of space though. i personally don't consider the trade off worth it, especially in a mod which is already quite large. for things like architecture you can tile textures or use different textures for different parts, so you could get the same crispness by making sure a smaller texture is taking up less model space.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Like Koniption, I'll stand by Lady Nerevar here too. Whenever I'm trying to cut down the size of our assets, the textures are the first things I look at. Some textures are just so unnecessarily huge. Let me know if it looks crap if you reduce the texture size and we can certainly make exceptions for the shrines if we desperately need to...

[Lady Nerevar]

good UV mapping is really crucial when it comes to textures. dividing your model into multiple nitriStrips and giving it multiple textures can cut down on size a lot because it allows you to re-use elements. as of 2k3, unreal tournament often had one texture per item, while oblivion and morrowind typically use two or more. that way, the metal on a barrel, a crate, and an anvil can all use the same texture, which saves you space in the long run.

you probably already know this, but just sayin'