Regional Claims

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Along with a few other references to this topic elsewhere, I noticed that there was a need to do some regional editing. sandor and TheImperialDragon from ST have often mentioned how difficult and dull this is but nonetheless absolutely critical for success. It does make a tremendous difference to the ability of other modders to come in and do a great job on something though.

So I thought I would raise this topic as well. I know that BM is thankfully not nearly as big as ST (which is a HUGE bonus, if you ask me because then we're much more likely to actually see some actual results FAST!).

The proposed beta, as far as I know, is the eastern regions as mentioned by Deeza earlier (btw, it still won't allow me to post up a pic here because the 'file size is too large' - for a 129kb pdf doc?).

We already have an idea for the 'Parchlands' that is currently in development (see other thread) but I think we also need to discuss, if not the details of what flora, textures, trees and so on are going to appear in other regions then at least how the map could be divided up.

Personally, I would have the following:

* 'Blackwood Approach' - the north-eastern part of the beta (name to be decided upon?)
* The Parchlands - the south-eastern part of the beta
* 'Helstrom Hive' and Murkwood - the central area around the main city that I think should be shaped in a thin strip leading right down to the lake and, I think, features Murkwood (name to be decided upon?)
* 'Blackrose' and 'Lilmoth' southern swamps - the southern area from the lake to the left of Moonmarch as high as Okeen-Re but slanting down towards Archon and basically forming our largest swamp region. (name to be decided upon?)
* Between 'Riverbridge', 'Gutam-Che' and 'Thorn' - an area of probably the most densely forested land that forms a sort of triangle and appears to border Morrowind. (name to be decided upon?)

[Deeza]

Actually, I just found this is already done by the previous core! Please see the attached picture. Obviously it's up to us to decide how much of this we want to keep, but it's a great starting point.

KEY TO MAP:
Blue: Mangrove Swamps
Purple: Everglades-style/tropical rainforest
Yellow: Murkwood
Bright Green: Blackwood
Dark Green: Dense jungle
Cyan: Marshes

Edit: I also found this list of region names, also made by the previous core (see second attached picture). I think there are perhaps too many of them, and the areas named are sometimes very small (for example, there's no point dividing Blackwood into "Storm Forest", when it could all just be blackwood). Still, we can pick and choose what we want from this. Some of the names, like the Wamasus Hills and Marauder Coast, are pretty good.

Note: neither of these maps contain the Parchlands. I assume that these are quite old and that it was a later addition.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Originally posted by Deeza
...I think there are perhaps too many of them...

Actually, I quite like it like myself. It might break up the work into more manageable sections. As long as the regions show evidence of a gradual change in the flora and so on, rather than an abrupt one then I'm sure it would work quite nicely. Thanks a lot for the maps, btw. Those are perfect :goodjob: .

[Deeza]

Yes, but I think the rhyming and alliterating ones need to go - "Foggy Bog", "Moss Mire" and "Gator Glades" don't have the same... ring to them as the others.

I suggest we use Taansha Bog instead of Foggy Bog (it's in KuKulza's many books and mentioned as the ancestral homeland of the Naga), and that we replace Gator Glades with Kothringi Glades (from the same place, the former Kothringi capital city, destroyed by Khanaten Flu).

By the way I think these maps are quite old, because they don't have the parchlands and some of the names appear to be different in later literature. See my second edit above.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Sounds good to me :goodjob:

[Deeza]

OK. If I can think of any other possible changes later, I'll post them here. Most of the names are fine. I just think that we could do something more imaginative than calling something "Misty" or "Mossy".

Does anyone else have any suggestions?

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Sorry to interrupt your 'naming' topics, Deeza.

I'm going to have a go at the Region Editing tutorial when I get the chance. With a bit of luck I can get some help from others such as TID, RW and sandor from ST. I do like the smallness of the Regions as it not only allows for variety but it should also prove more manageable for my creaky old machine, as Region Editing takes up a lot of the PC's resources....but I'm uncertain....

From what I see here, our beta regions include the following:

Ok-Nanha Jungle
Storm Forest
Panther River
Blackwood
Onkobra River
Moss Mire
Misty Hills
Marauder Coast
Topal Island (in collaboration with Elsweyr, I believe)

On second glance, it does appear to be a lot so I think Deeza is right, especially for Moss Mire and Misty Hills (which could be combined into something like 'Rottmere Everglades'?). The slightly inelegant 'Storm Forest' combined with the more seemly 'Ok-Nanha Jungle' could be combined into 'Naga-Cradle Jungle'. In the meantime, I don't see any reason why the rivers themselves should be separate regions. It's probably something to do with region editing which I'll come across later. I wonder if Trollf, the creator of the 'Panther River' mod for 'Unique Landscapes' would be interested in continuing his work here though.

However, what's curious here is that 'the Parchlands' is basically the 'Marauder Coast'. I'm reluctant to dispense with the latter as, if I remember rightly, it's lore-specific, isn't it? That said, they could be one and the same, as long as 'Parchlands' refers to the region and 'MC' refers only to the coast itself.

This leaves me with the following options:

1) Blackwood - nice and easy for starters.
2) The Parchlands - shouldn't be too hard considering it's barren-ness.
3) Rottmere Everglades (or whatever it gets called)
4) Naga-Cradle Jungle (or whatever it gets called)

The rivers should probably be dealt with later. I think that Panther River especially, should be very waterfall-ridden.

What we could then do with is an official discussion thread (which can also be used to keep official information from prying eyes) where flora is suggested for the region in question. I can check out 'Blackwood' myself for the correct models but I would also benefit from introducing a few more BM-based items to effect the transition. That would mean someone passing on a bsa archive, suggesting trees and flora and then agreeing on them, before giving me the editor ID for the model.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Could we please reach a consensus on this (the details discussed above)? I'm not blessed with tons of modding time but I thought that I might be able to stretch myself into doing some region modding that would seriously advance the project, particularly as I think this is desperately needed if we are to move into our next stage of (probably) recruitment and promotions. We would need this so that we can set things up into the sort of state that newcomers could take the ball and run with it.

To that extent, I would need some co-ordinates for regions besides the named regions themselves. Something like this would be perfect: http://gallery.silgrad.com/albums/userpi...LNFull.png . If we have everything laid out then we can open the doors to others.

btw, I walked around the mod recently and couldn't get Gideon or other towns to appear for some reason. I think it's probably because I've got the ST esm loaded as well but I noticed that Stormhold is unfinished. I guess I could sort that out as part of the region modding if I find the time to do it. It won't be for a while yet though.

[Deeza]

I'm afraid I don't know how to do the region co-ordinates myself. But I will do my best.

I'm not a member of the Core, so I don't know how much this counts for, but I would start with Blackwood and Storm Forest (basically the same). I like the idea of Panther River having waterfalls, but Argonia doesn't have many hills..... is there some way we could make rushing rapids for the river instead?

As for the Marauder Coast/Parchlands problem, if I were you I would leave it as Marauder Coast for now. The Argonians could call it the Parchlands in spoken dialogue.

Stormhold was never finished because the guy who was building it left the project and we've been unable to contact him.

[Ibsen's Ghost]

Originally posted by Deeza
I would start with Blackwood and Storm Forest (basically the same).

That's what I was planning but we desperately need some regions marking out and, if we plan to merge this with mainland Cyrodiil, it needs to segue neatly into the map. Either way, I'd like to see some LOD as well so someone is needed to get this going. I could possibly handle Stormhold myself.

I like the idea of Panther River having waterfalls, but Argonia doesn't have many hills..... is there some way we could make rushing rapids for the river instead?

I've used Texians water meshes frequently in the past and they've proved perfect for this purpose so yes, absolutely! However, I would like to be able to broaden them a bit more (by setting each one to a particular factor size, perhaps) so as to enhance the River...and there will definitely need to be some hills so that it can get some speed up.