Nerevarine

[Axen]

Originally posted by final reclaimer
but betrayel is the most effective, effective enough for a house to fall, when it is unexpected. we could make them think of their brothers as 'twisted', and that would be their way of making the end justify the means.

that could turn out to be a little unbelievable, but if its done right it could work.

Yeah, how about everyone in every Dunmer house starts killing each other because people in Hlaalu might think their brothers are corrupt, people in Redoran might think their brothers are wrong for being aristocratic, and the Telvanni start killing each other over some major incident that caused some archmage's experiment to go bezerk? <_<

[raggidman]

Originally posted by Axen

Originally posted by final reclaimer
but betrayel is the most effective, effective enough for a house to fall, when it is unexpected. we could make them think of their brothers as 'twisted', and that would be their way of making the end justify the means.

that could turn out to be a little unbelievable, but if its done right it could work.

Yeah, how about everyone in every Dunmer house starts killing each other because people in Hlaalu might think their brothers are corrupt, people in Redoran might think their brothers are wrong for being aristocratic, and the Telvanni start killing each other over some major incident that caused some archmage's experiment to go bezerk? <_<

From what I have seen of Dunmer society and others in ES that is not so far from the reality as one might expect... buuuuut, we are not talking about conscious choice with Dagoth Ur - he actively invaded the dreams and consciousness of 'his' people and distorted their personalities, corrupted them through 'reprogramming' techniques and with a lot of lies and distortions thrown in.

There have to be those Dagoth Ur did not reach, the unborn, or newborn, or infants who were yet to be affected. Then there would be those who's identities had not been completely subsumed, and who alone or with help from their loved ones could be 'brought back' and even those strong enough to rebuild their own personalities after the loss of Dagoth Ur's guiding mentality. Also the irrecoverable victims - take a look in the coprasarium...

There really has to be a serious look taken at all these 'odds and ends.'

Ummm, I do hope that former 'dagothites' are not now in 'denial' of their past misdeeds and therefore refusing to consider the matter. As players we are free to do that, but as developers we have to be willing to do the heavy thinking and put some hard work into it. :yes:

[final reclaimer]

Originally posted by Axen

Originally posted by final reclaimer
but betrayel is the most effective, effective enough for a house to fall, when it is unexpected. we could make them think of their brothers as 'twisted', and that would be their way of making the end justify the means.

that could turn out to be a little unbelievable, but if its done right it could work.

Yeah, how about everyone in every Dunmer house starts killing each other because people in Hlaalu might think their brothers are corrupt, people in Redoran might think their brothers are wrong for being aristocratic, and the Telvanni start killing each other over some major incident that caused some archmage's experiment to go bezerk? <_<

House Dagoth is the only house to have laid in a corrupt, dormant evil for so long they are known as an evil house. hlaalu, redoran, telvanni, dres, and indoril are stable enough inside their governing structures to not have any betrayels of that size to lst, unless there was some large play by some other houses, by means of blackmail and espionage.

House Dagoth was twisted for so long that a collapse is so expected it is almost needed.

[Axen]

The whole "House Dagoth getting accepted" thing just sucks. At least in the ways that's been suggested so far. Nobody likes it someone or some group being the villain in one game and then suddenly becoming goody two-shoes just like that the next.
House Dagoth is the most extremist House, remember.

[final reclaimer]

I say they are trying to come back in this mod, but Helseth turns many people against them, Hlaalu wipes them out, and Redoran, who supported them, gets pissed and attacks Hlaalu.

I think that we could use something involving a house dagoth comeback, if we already dont have a good one, as an idea to kick off the war.

[Axen]

Caldera is the spark. And Vivec's achieving of CHIM, causing a power void as the legitimate rule is gone, doesn't help at all.

[KuKulzA]

I really didn't mean that 6th House will be accepted like a neighbor...
I meant people won't attack you for being 6th House they'll just dislike you...

but I don't want the 6th House to collapse, it been around for thousands of years and the way I see it is this...
Dagoth Ur, despite leading it 'astray' has given it so many different faces... 6th House is what? 6th House today is a Dagoth-worshipping Cammona Tong thug, a mad Cultist, one of the Ash-kin, a barbarian Dunmer out in the Ashlands, a normal everyday person who sercetly worships an ash-statue everynight, or one of the occasional rebels who make Morrowind history more interesting...

thus the 6th House although not the same as it was, now has a lot of different pieces... if these pieces are all picked up.... the ash-kin are the wisest and most powerful, the barbarian Dunmer are the most martial, the Cammona-Tong affiliates most mercantile and wordly... and the normal Dagoths who don't even really seem like 6th House members are the most populous...


No I don't want 6th House to be welcome, but at least accepted...
if you chose to be in the 6th House it is like choosing to be a Vampire... it's hard to turn back...
I am thinking maybe SOMETHING involving the Temple will make them semi-acceptable... something that will force the Dunmer people to say "alright, we wronged them, if we won't repent at least accept them as they are and let them have Red Mt." cause that's the truth... and Temple-Dagoth stuff is supposed to be all about these two age-old enemies finally revealing their secrets (secretly if you know what I mean) and reforming and letting go a bit of the past... seeing as how the four characters in this thousand year old battle have all died save Vivec, the one who will reform the Temple... and the one who ended up fighting Dagoth Ur most, though he had less reason to hate him than say Almalexia...

[Axen]

Vivec will not reform the Temple. His priests will, after he is gone. It'll most likely exclude Azura, though.

[KuKulzA]

Originally posted by Axen
Vivec will not reform the Temple. His priests will, after he is gone. It'll most likely exclude Azura, though.

I think he will.... or at least he will make the orders...
bad people or semi-bad can do good things too ya know... why Helseth has reinstituted the Grand Council, not something that would help him as it allows political opposition.. but hey he is politics savvy...
Vivec reforms the Temple to make it more ancestor worship and Daedra worship inclusive...
but he could have some secret schemes behind that...

[Tibixe]

The full helmet is not enough. We need his/her voice, height etc.

To solve the nerevarine facegen problem, we need a little story:

The Nerevarine found an artifact, the Soul of the Mirror, on Akavir. By using this, everyone sees his face as his/her own, and the Nerevarine is always speaking in the voice of the llistener.

We only have to make a full actor copy of the player (just after the player's face is created) , give him AI packages, items, and new stats.

And what about the biography of the nerevarine? He/She is famous, so he/she must have a biography. And such a book must include facts about which factions did the nerevarine belong to, how does he/she look like etc.

I think I could write this book, featuring non-reliable informants. A khajiit thief, a former legion and fighters guilld member who is a drunkard, a breton mage accused of necromancy, a shady Morag Tong member, and clerics who want to increase the popularity of their cults all claim to be friends of the nerevarine and to know almost everything about him/her,
while they don't even agree on his/her race... Mehra Milo, Divyath Fyr, the ashlanders, the Blades, and all the others who know the truth, don't speak about it. Others who met him/her are not sure whether he/she was the nerevarine or no. Faction records were lost beacause different purposes.

Do you like this idea?