Silgrad Tower from the Ashes

Another idea...
How about adding creatures to battles. For example Silt Strider will be
excellent tower for archers (Altitude will give them advantage, Silt Strider's armor will protect).

Quote:Originally posted by raz
Another idea...
How about adding creatures to battles. For example Silt Strider will be
excellent tower for archers (Altitude will give them advantage, Silt Strider's armor will protect).

Could be interesting, but wouldn't it be a bit difficult to do?

Being a compulsive contributor I am going to go through this thread bit by bit, because although I know you have all traded and discarded some great ideas, there are aspects to both surviving and accepted ideas that have the feel of unexplored potential = they might offer more if they find a new form. Others need to be re-examined.

You may feel that you are past this stage, but I still hope that the following will be of use. What I will try to do is blend all the ideas in an ongoing saga, independently of other decisions so that it can act as either a basis for developement or something separate to bounce ideas off.

Starting with the first page of this thread:
First Commentary - Part One

Vivec and Nerevar

According to TES 4 NPC Lore they have disappeared - that is to say from the view of the common man.

This does not mean that they did nothing before they 'disappeared.' Which opens up the way for video clips and such that are doom or prophesy laden...

Vivec
We know what Vivec looked like - is Ves older now? Maybe Ves has disappeared from view because Ves is worried that Ves aged appearance would worry those who still have faith in Ves?

or maybe Ves has been kidnapped??? = possible cause of war:
by Helseth, a fine reason for people to hate Helseth;
by evil Daedra worshippers backed by the power of their patron;
by remnants of the 6th House seeking to remove their last great enemy;
by the Chancellor who wants to sow chaos...

Vivec might be holed up in a deep cavern - living out Ves last centuries as a hermit. But would that take away the mystery?

What if you combine images of Vivec and images of the Nerevarine as follows:

Nerevarine We have no idea even of the Nerevarine's sex - get real. you substitute your personal vision of the Nerevarine for everyone else's then you p... on all their experiences...

But you can have a shadowy figure in a film clip/vision who sets the scene - ref Azura's visions - with the vocals so distorted that you cannot tell whether the voice is male or female - only that it is under great duress... giving you a mesage of dire import - go solve it... alternating with images of Vivec in an unidentifiable location... you can trust me now - honest... atoning - remorseful ('pologies noremorse, no pun intended) desperate to protect Ves peple but now otherwise powerless to interfere...other than through your dreams... powerful stuff.

Vivec gives you a dream? How? Through a Dream Crystal delivered to you by... NPC X. Dream says Vivec has been warned of cataclysm to come and entrusts this crystal to ... to deliver to ... in the event of Ves disappearance and certain portents that Ves has been warned of...

thus Vivec is there and not there. Welcome to the New Morrowind...da da daaa daaaaa. Usher in the Atronach Quests... a nice little warmer (or is it a cooler?) everything is maleable here...


First Commentary - Part 2

Helseth
Helseth and the Duke are both Hlaalu, and appointed by the Imperials, and Barenziah is always Helseth's mum, loved by everyone. To get to Helseth you have to get to Barenziah = very unpopular move. Didn't you read her life stories? No one hates her, and not only because she has become a peerless stateswoman.

Also she taught Helseth, who is a very naughty boy, but NEVER actually gets caught = the reason why you love to hate him is partly because you can never get to him. Shit floats to the top.

Dream Crystal 2 held by the Athemusa Shamaness (no idea or explanation as to where it came to her from, when or circumstances, just as with Vivec, Crystal says 'am now older and wiser than on arrival in Vvardenfell, have learned much hidden lore, all in the nature of intimations of disaster - consequences of the fall of the Red Tower) = these add up to a 'shady' warning from the Nerevarine, and a call by the Nerevarine to hold a 2nd Grand Council of Morrowind if certain events transpire...such as a comet...

The Grand Council in great expectation and excitement only to be interrupted by the assassins... and everyone suspects a different group of sending them!

Who dunnit: Maybe this is the work of the 6th House under a new guise setting up the diversion necessary to get at Divayth Fir's research... but lthough they are beaten off, one of them not knowing what he/she/it has gotten ahold of manages to steal the third Dream Crystal from... chose the sender and the holder later.

alternative who dunnit: someone substitutes a fake Dream Crystal that kills the user... cause to be or not to be revealed - maybe the Chancellor's Agents - maybe... chooose...

The upshot is that the Great Houses instead of pulling together, factionalise further... the first rumblings of war...

This would be ironic if there really is a serious reason for the 3rd Dream Crystal's existance = very serious Lore in accord with the best of TES 4 Lore on the 7/8 Towers etc? Lore on this that will have an ompact past the assumption of the Heir esp on Morrowind because of the Destruction of the Red Tower ( some of you may have heard of 1999? who hs posted some interesting speculation on the ES Forums - will post a link here or copy a convenient later)

Who will be the Arbiter of the Council? Must it be Helseth - he is the King and many dislike him, but others support him. The Duke is the Emperor's Local Vvardenfell Administrator, but Helseth is the Emperor's Provincial King. and they are both Hlaalu. On the surface t least they will appear to trust each other though the Duke will be reserved in the face of the dislocation that the Empire is suffering.

Whatever happens at the Council all will agree that any dispute will be restricted to Vvardenfell itself...

more to come...

I've been checking these forums lately and I must say that I don't like the Mainquest.... Why not make you the hero of Vvardenfell by stopping some Oblivion gates(or, more like the idea 'above' this post: Vivec has been kidnapped by daedra to Oblivion). Because that's much more 'Obliviony', instead of die-hard Morrowind.

Sidenote on Cliffracers: according to a conversation in OB St. Jiub killed all the cliffracers :banana:

We're having a small Oblivion questline, but it'll be minor.

Quote:Originally posted by Cuthalion
I've been checking these forums lately and I must say that I don't like the Mainquest.... Why not make you the hero of Vvardenfell by stopping some Oblivion gates(or, more like the idea 'above' this post: Vivec has been kidnapped by daedra to Oblivion). Because that's much more 'Obliviony', instead of die-hard Morrowind.

Sidenote on Cliffracers: according to a conversation in OB St. Jiub killed all the cliffracers :banana:

there will be some cliffracers, the Oblivion Gates won't be the major part of this mainquest.... didn't you know there is a huge civil war going on? but you still wanna fight Daedra? well you can do that too! plenty of Daedra, but that's not the focus of the mod...

Quote:Originally posted by Axen
We're having a small Oblivion questline, but it'll be minor.

are we? Oblivion? not quite... atronach cult, a some portals you will close in House-quests, but nothing huge;y Oblivion

Quote:Originally posted by KuKulzA

Quote:Originally posted by Axen
We're having a small Oblivion questline, but it'll be minor.

are we? Oblivion? not quite... atronach cult, a some portals you will close in House-quests, but nothing huge;y Oblivion

I didn't feel like describing the Atronach Cult to him. (I have a headache right now. >_<)

One aspect that needs to be tought about is when did Vivec disappear, ditto the Nerevarine (assuming the idea is to go with the Lore coming through from Ob) and therefore how are the letters and notes that Vivec had been keeping for the Nerevarine to explain how Ves saw the likely changes coming and Ves' planned reaction to them.

If you did the Temple Hierarchy quests all the way to the top then you learn that Vivec does indeed have plans to lead Ves people back into the Velothi ways, and I would think that would bring them closer to the Ashlanders customs.

Ashlanders Remember that there is only one Aslander Tribe that remains close to the Telvanni. the Ahemmusa trot off over the waters to their summer retreat, the Urshilaku actually prefer the Redorans, and the southern tribe, the Erabenimsum have just decided to rid themselves of a dishonorable leader and his cronies, and return to the old ways.

If the Ordinators remain with the Temple (and where else can they go?) then they are evolving towards Velothi Teachings, particularly the Good Daedra as accepted by the Tribunal's Teachings = probably Azura esp. Unless you believe that the Ordinators eliminate Vivec?

So the Temple and the Ashlanders might be together. As the situation has changed. And the Nerevarine likely played a part in bringing them together, before disappearing.

The Redorans in accepting this would be turning to acceptance of a simpler acceptance of life in some ways, more defensive, and focussed on repelling the invading Nords and defending their new and very vulnerable friends the Ashlanders.

The Telvanni do as the Telvanni will, and a role for them closing Oblivion Gates is well considered, as they have the necesary lore in the absence of Vivec. (Hold that thought) Their only Aslander allies, the Zainab seem inconsequential to me, and might well be turning to the Temple if the Temple really has returned to Velothi ways.


What remains is how much has the Temple really changed? The Dissident Priests (remember them?) will have risen up into the Temple Hiearchy, or the whole thing collapses as having no purpose or direction. Vivec has made his peace with them, and the Ordinators have no choice but to acceed. Because they acted in the name of the Tribunal and the last of the Tribunal decrees a new direction.

The witch hunters have a whale of a time fighting the invading Daedra alongside the Telvanni!

that leaves Indoril - well they have lost a lot of respect because they obviously opposed the Nerevarine and the Dissident Priests until the last moment, and the Dissident Priests will accomodate to a point, but Indoril are not of the future. The Nerevarine did not come from their ranks as they were opposed to so many of his purposes and essential ties. In Nerevar's absence his widow Almalexia married Vivec and set herself up for a big fall. As the last great Captain of Indoril her loss has hurt them. Where can they go to now?

So we have the two real combattants: Hlaalu and Dres.

The situation looks on the surface like a straightforward battle between the Dres isolationist, (vampire-ridden?) until lately slaving farmers - as KK and Dragoonwraith on the Elsweyr Forum have been lately describing them, and the Empire Aligned Hlaalu traders and (also lately slaving farmers.)

Both houses have the question of what to do with the freed slaves (if that is what they have done) but there is another twist to the situation = King Helseth just married a Dres noblewoman???? Now she has just GOT TO BE A VAMPIRE. esp given Helseth's education by the Underking (play Daggerfall, do the quest for Barenziah) so maybe what seems to be a war to the death, to anyone caught up in it, is really just removing the unwanted and excess former slaves with a bit of score settling and territorial acquisition, as both the Hlaalu and their unacknowledged allies Dres (currently called the enemy) hoover up a few choice bits according to Helseth's Wedding Treaty...

The 6th House will once again be able to hide as now therre are no new sleepers and Ascended - they have an agenda re our pal Divayth's research... hold that thought as I have to go for today.

Ummmm KuKulzA, I don't know if you will forgive me for accusing you of being the King of Changes, but you did ask for feedback...

And please remember that any House that is 'reputed' to be run by Vampires in Morrowind is NOT going to find any allies... in the open.

But do Vampires care about 6th House Ascended etc? After all, as tey are Vampires were the affected by the blight?

@Reggidman: I don't think the 6th House should be much of a problem, their leader and all their power has gone byebye and we really shouldn't start repeating badguys....

Wouldn't it be neat if Vivec would've been taken to Oblivion when the gates were still open, and that when you destroyed every gate he was actually trapped in there? You might have to go and find a way to get into Oblivion once more(I'm thinking of an OB book here, don't remember it's name though it was in the Order of the Virtuous Blood base(how do you write Virtuous?)). It would be cool because you'll have the political effects + some small storyline that involves Oblivion....

Funnily enough I am not suggesting that I want them in there, what I am trying to do is offer an Oblivion-Lore adjusted version of the plans that all the guys here have been discussing the past weeks and months - in the expectation that many of my offerings will be shot down, but might help the fial version to reach a fuller stage of developement.


So let's address your response by my attempting to support a 6th House continuation:

Do consider that not all the 6th House were sleepers - I am sure that there are still many scattered throughout the Great Houses who were waiting for the 'Call' before revealing themselves in open war...

And if you played Daggerfall and Morrowind and have read the stories, you will realise that they are accustomed to acting in secret - have done so for thousands of years, but that in Morrowind they were getting ready for the 'big push' when the Nerevarine under the influence of Azura etc inconveniently cut off their head.

They have had ten or twenty years to recover and review their options - it aint unreasonable that they will be looking for new ways to achieve their objectives. The Nerevarine was just one mortal... so what have the Great Houses and Imperials been doing in the meantime?

Have they sent an army into Red Mountain? If they did I have not heard of this = no rumours...

Looks almost as if they all sat back and just assumed that the whole thing was finished - maybe the 6th House does not agree? But they know they no longer have Dagoth Ur's sheer power, nor the Heart of Lorkhan, so they are looking for a new edge.

Thus the guys are thinking: who knows about blight and stuff? Answer = Divayth Fyr = a side quest is already being discussed for an invasion or penetration of the Corrusarium and an attempt to steal Divayth Fyr's research notes.

Another essential is that the 6th House find a new Leader - they have had many in their long history. If the 6th House is a playable faction even the player could become that leader... or attempt to assassinate the new one...

Do remember that, although under Dagoth Ur they used somewhat repulsive methods to boost their power, they are basically Dark Elves, just like the other Great Houses. Sure they might use Ascended and blighted creatures, but those will be dying out unless something major happens... so can the 6th House erstore its reputation, or does it continue as a secret society?

And what are the new key Lore elements that are revealed in Oblivion if any that could be applied to re-brand the 6th House as an openly acknowledged Great House once more? Say maybe they come out fighting the daedric invasion. They were prophesying it, and inviting converts to rally to their banner on the basis that the Empire would be overwhelmed by an invasion from Oblivion. Now they have been proven correct, not just rabblerousers...

Wadja think Cuthalion?